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Need Advise for nearly new 912 that sat for years

in 912 / 914 Technical Questions 12 years ago
Hi all. First post on this great Forum.

I am looking at an uncompleted Kitfox powered by a first generation (?)912. sn: 4152.14xx (couldn't see the last 2 digits) The engine was started, probably 8-10 years ago, and run for about 1.5 hours, according to the Hobbs. Sludge and varnish in the gascolator and carb bowls. Engine was shut down and left as it was. (sigh) Needless to say, I have lots of concerns. I have a good bore scope and differential compression tester. Looking for advise. can I, should I pre-oil the engine before turning it over? Hand prop or battery to spin? Is there a way to get a visual on the cam short of a tear down? Is my concern for the condition of the valve springs warranted?

The current owner bought the plane maybe 10 years ago with intentions of paying somebody to finish the build. That never happened. Needless to say, he's not a lot of help.

Comments and suggestions on how to proceed are greatly appreciated.

Thanx
Lee

  • Re: Need Advise for nearly new 912 that sat for years

    by » 12 years ago

    Hi Lee,

    Welcome to the forum and nice to have you join us.

    There are a few things here that should be done and maybe not what you want to hear. You may have a good engine for your project, but you need to do a few things first. Because the engine has so many years on it just sitting, there have been several bulletins that need to be done and more importantly the "O" rings are most likely shot which are all throughout the engine and seals for the crank case and gearbox need to be checked. The engine is probably very dry inside and should have some
    pre-lubrication on internal parts before a start. If it were me and Rotax highly recommends it that this engine needs to be seen by a Service Center (I don't know where you live) and have it stripped down, all "O" rings replaced and there are a lot of them and very important ones, SB's done and
    pre-oil all the internal parts. It will cost several thousand dollars, but will save the engine from any major start up damage.

    The second part here is you sound fairly new to a Rotax engine and I would highly recommend downloading from this site (http://www.rotax-owner.com/support/engine-manuals) all the manuals (5) for your engine and read them before any start. There are some good videos for you to watch here too. I would recommend at least a Rotax Service 2 day class and if you have a Rotax trained person near you use them as a possible resource. If you try to start this engine by just putting oil in it you will ruin it. Read the Installation, Operations and Line Maint. manuals first before any 912 first start and talk to a Rotax Service Center.

    If we here on the forum can help just ask and I'm sure lots of people will jump in.

    Good luck on your project.

    Roger Lee
    LSRM-A & Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
    Tucson, AZ Ryan Airfield (KRYN)
    520-349-7056 Cell

      
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  • Re: Need Advise for nearly new 912 that sat for years

    by » 12 years ago

    Roger, thanks for the quick reply. I was hoping to hear from you. You are correct, I am new to Rotax engines. A lot of experience elsewhere, but not here. I have also spent many evenings reading posts on this Forum. Very informative. Haven't got into the manuals yet. Thanx for the link.

    I think I may have been misleading. I have no intentions of trying to start this engine. I agree that would eliminate any chance of saving this engine. As you suggested, I fully expect to tear the engine down for seals, o-rings, and SBs.

    I am trying to put a price in this project, and the condition of the engine is a major consideration here. So I would like to take a look into the cylinders with the bore scope. I hesitate to turn a dry engine, hence my desire to pre-oil. The cylinders are easy, but the bearings are another story. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Or do you think the cylinders are probably OK? Or that this is a bad idea. What about the camshaft? I know all this is tough. But it is also tough to tell the owner his almost zero time engine is junk without some concrete evidence. Although, I have already advised him that the engine will likely need to be torn down for seals and o-rings. Thanx for the confirmation. Learning as fast as I can here.

    Thanks again. I do appreciate you time and experience.

    Lee
      
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  • Re: Need Advise for nearly new 912 that sat for years

    by » 12 years ago

    Hi Lee,

    Any idea how many hours on the engine?

    I don't think the engine is junk, but time has its ravages. If this engine just has a few hours on it and is new as far as hours go you may not be replacing worn parts other that "O" rings, a few SB parts and re-sealing the crank case and gearbox. You'll need to call a Service Center that does overhaul. My guess on a price may be be as low as $3K-$4K and upwards of $8K. What's in your favor is no real time and worn parts to deal with.

    I may be way off here so I hope Rob here on the forum which is at a Service Center will jump in and get you a little closer to a price.

    Roger Lee
    LSRM-A & Rotax Instructor & Rotax IRC
    Tucson, AZ Ryan Airfield (KRYN)
    520-349-7056 Cell

      
    Report

  • Re: Need Advise for nearly new 912 that sat for years

    by » 12 years ago

    Your spot on Roger,
    A teardown inspection including; all new seals/gaskets/o-rings with test run with dynamic analysis is approx $3500. Turnaround is 1 week.
    Be very leary of backyard shops using non-Rotax o-rings and seals.
    Rob
    Thank you said by: Roger Lee
      
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  • Re: Need Advise for nearly new 912 that sat for years

    by » 12 years ago

    Lee,
    No one has answered your question of whether it is safe to turn the engine over (by hand, I assume) for the purpose of inspecting various parts. My guess is you'd turn it over just enough to expose various components, maybe one or two revolutions or so?
    I don't consider myself a good enough engine man to advise you in this matter. Maybe one of the others will come back to the question and answer what you really asked.
    If I were in your shoes, I'd call the best mechanic I could find at Lockwood, LEAF or another engine rebuild center and ask the question before I turned it over.
    I would be afraid of friction involving any rust, including microscopic rust, that could start galling.
      
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