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  • Re: 912UL Engine vibration on throttle back

    by » 12 years ago


    Fuel is correct grade, as fresh as can get as I fly regularly, Mogas predominantly. Check for water, nil found. Don't have a return line, fire sleeved hose, auxiliary facet pump.

  • Re: 912UL Engine vibration on throttle back

    by » 12 years ago


    Hi, I have been following this thread with interest as my plane (a Europa) exhibits the same issue. I remember a long time ago saving an e-mail on my pc from a thread on the Europa forum where other owners were also experiencing this. The message was written in reply by the US Europa agent who is an extremely knowledgeable and great all round chap. He covers the usual culprits such as carb synch, binding throttle cables etc... but the last paragraph which I have copied below might be of interest as I don't think it has been covered so far here:

    (Reproduced from Europa Forum e-mail): Finally, if you have a fixed pitch prop (especially a Warp Drive) and you throttle back in flight above 80 KIAS, the prop, when windmilling (being driven by the wind) from high speed sets up a nasty noise and bit of vibration. It is just like compression braking, and the 912S and gearbox combo with this prop will tend to vibrate. This is the gear box lash and turbulence off the prop making the nasty noise and bit of vibration. This is quite startling to the new Europa passenger. The Airmaster AP332 will also set up a vibration when compression braking in a rapid descent by moving the prop from cruise to climb at low power, as the blade change to a flatter setting sets up a bit of turbulence... When doing a speed run at cruise of about 140 KIAS, I rarely move the prop to climb with the power set below 31 inches because it scares the customers with the sound change and vibration. The comment is usually "is it supposed to do that!". (End)

    Certainly my own plane which has exactly this set up; 912ULS with ground adjustable Warp, does exactly this. When throttling back from high speed and high RPM a point is reached when SUDDENLY, increasing vibration and noise is experienced which shakes the whole plane. It's so sudden it's like switching on a switch! I can usually avoid this happening by reducing airspeed significantly before reducing power. It doesn't do it then and never does it during full power runs on the ground, which makes me think it is aerodynamic effects rather than a fault in the engine. The engine runs beautifully at all other times. Hope this may be of some interest, please ignore if not! Cheers!

  • Re: 912UL Engine vibration on throttle back

    by » 12 years ago


    I concur, the 80 hp Rotax with ground adjustable two blade WD prop on my Rans S6-116 certainly lightly vibrates on throttling down. I'd accepted it as an engine prop effect, though rather disconcerting at first encounters.

    However these mild tremors and not to be confused with major engine shaking and apparent ignition failure/misfiring which is as I understand the root problem addressed by this thread.

    The word 'vibration' covers such a wide range of meanings it really needs qualifying, just as Jonathan has described for the less than scary end of the spectrum.

    What I'm still hoping to see esablished by one of our regular searchers here is what does cause the major engine surges, which are almost endemic despite folk applying the 'known' set ups very carefully. Surely we cannot all be that stupid ...... Or ....???

    BTW. Is that UK Jonathan who had a yellow Cub ?

    mike hallam

  • Re: 912UL Engine vibration on throttle back

    by » 12 years ago


    Hi Mike - I am a "UK Jonathan", but not with a yellow cub! Someone else is guilty of that!!

  • Re: 912UL Engine vibration on throttle back

    by » 12 years ago


    Dear Forumites

    I have the exact same problem on my 912 UL (980 TTSN) installed on a Hawk Arrow 2 (0 hrs). Refer to my EGT records which clearly show that something is very wrong, but it doesn't say why. Note that the thermocouple on cylinder 2 reads high, I'm ASSUming that it closely follows the EGT of cylinder 4, but remains operational when combustion in cylinder 4 shuts down.



    These are the symptoms:
    1) It feels like the engine is missing that final kick on full throttle. I'm generally getting a rate of climb of about 600 fpm from 4,300 AGL at say 82°F OAT. Other Hawk pilots say I should be getting 1,000fpm. So I'm low on power.
    2) The engine only revs to max 5,400 rpm at an IAS of 80 mph. I have a new 2 bladed wooden prop, 73", 39° pitch, which was designed and supplied by someone who has been in the game long enough. The design should put the revs at 5,600/5,700 at 80mph. Another indication that I'm low on power.
    3) The spark plugs on cylinders 1 and 3 are sooty black, the spark plugs on cylinder 2 are more glossy black, the spark plugs on cylinder 4 look new. After 6 hours of mostly runway operation the insulator is as white as it left the factory (Very similar to Kevin's in post 4961)!? The spark plugs are all new and I'm running unleaded mogas.
    4) With the spark plug cap removed, all 8 have a strong blue spark. I didn't check the timing.
    5) The aircraft sometimes vibrates after throttling back from full power and it sounds as if the rpms aren't quite stable.
    6) Ignition test rpm drops @ 4,000rpm: 1 = 250rpm, 2 = 150rpm.
    7) Fuel flow maxes out at about 18l/h (4.8gph), pressure at 0.4bar, and 11l/h at slow cruise. I feel the fuel flow is low for full throttle, but I haven't calibrated the system yet, so the flow reading may be off. The fuel pressure went above normal when cylinder 4 first cut out, between 07h50 and 07h53.
    8 ) Carburettor synchronization was done, but turning the idle mixture screw didn't really change the engine speed, so I left it at 1.5 turns out. I visually checked for air-leaks and can't find any.

    I don't think it can be the ignition, since the two spark plugs on cylinder 4 are powered by different modules and different timing pick-ups, and any problem with either would also affect other cylinders. But if it is the carburettor, why is cylinder 2 behaving properly?

    A local 912 guru is adamant that the diaphragms need replacing. On the one hand a carburettor overhaul wouldn't hurt, it would be high time anyway, and other forumites had good results with minor carb overhaulsbut the overhaul kit is quite expensive and I'd hate to fiddle with things that aren't broken.
    EGT_Drop1.JPG (You do not have access to download this file.)

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